Re: My New CF

Post by MattA24 » Subscribing Member » Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:38 pm
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:06 pm
Posts: 213
Golly Phil, thanks again for another tidal wave of facts.

The alternator fine worked when I drove home, so I'm hopeful it's still good. Otherwise the parts van has a nearly new alternator of the generic two-wire sort. When I got the van, there was nothing at all plugged into the "-" socket (next to the thick brown wire that goes to "+"), but it still seemed to keep the battery topped up though, with the lights on and all.

The engine sounded pretty sweet on the drive home, so I'm hopeful it's just the sensor as you suggest. I'll smash the end off and wedge a socket on. All my AF sockets are six-sided so all is well. The fact you suggest I'll need the big bar is ominous! The sensor unscrewed from the parts van so easily.

Glad the spring thing is probably unimportant. Odd that there's only one one one side. I'd not be at all shocked to hear the van had been running overweight, just from the shear amount of laminate flooring someone had gone crazy with in the back. Laminate flooring on the walls, bulkheads, cupboards, kitchen, dashboard, ceiling, everywhere except the floor!

But anyhow, the van will be running a good deal lighter when I'm done with it, so I think the springy thingy can go.

Cheers! :brew:

Re: My New CF

Post by MattA24 » Subscribing Member » Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:41 pm
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:06 pm
Posts: 213
I was having trouble getting the cables to plug into that alternator, so I pulled it to take a better look. The "+" terminal that the thick brown wire should go to was just a crusty stub of its former self - no wonder the alternator light flickered from time to time on the drive home. The cable must have only been resting there. I'm going to have to open that alternator up to see if I can clean up the remains and solder a bit of wire to it.

So in the mean time, I've pulled the alternator off the parts van. I thought this was a two-wire type job, but on inspection... it's a three-wire one:

Image

I'm guessing with this setup I still want to delete the small brown wire and stick the stripy wire on the smaller of the three pins? Then it's a case of working out which of the other two pins the big brown wire goes on, and which is for an earth? :?:

By the way, the loom on this van doesn't have a black wire, and there was nothing plugged into the (intact) "-" terminal. There is a condenser-type thing mounted nearby plugged into nothing though. Would that have been that? :?:

***

With the top smashed off the oil pressure sensor (which I enjoyed), the rest spun out with a socket and the forceful application of elbow, and the working one from the spares van spun happily in.

But on the topic of oil, something rather annoying about this particular van is the dipstick, which I just can't seem to read. It always comes out faintly oily all over but with no definitive level visible on it. When I bought the van it looked like there was hardly any oil in there (below the bottom of the dipstick), so I kept putting oil in, and still nothing helpful. I ended up dropping all oil and refilling it with what I knew to be the correct right amount, to drive it home.

The stick is much skinnier than the one on my other CFs, and the tube it goes down is bent into a graceful 'S' and held that way by a little clip next to the oil filter mounting. I'm going to try and remember to take a picture of it tomorrow, so perhaps someone can enlighten me as to whether it's a proper CF one or not.

I'm used to CFs loosing a bit of oil as they go, and so I check the level at least weekly. I don't want to have to drop it out and measure it and tip it back in all the flipping time!

***

In other news, starting fitting my LPG stuff. Here's the vaporiser tucked away under the heater snout:

Image

Re: My New CF

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Post by Phil Bradshaw » Club admin » Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:05 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm
Posts: 3791
Lucas 17ACR unit: both the larger terminals should be connected together (visible without removal of the plastic end cover) -

Image

17ACR alternator ground is through the casing; suppressor capacitor (if fitted) should be inside the unit and connected to the outer brush with the regulator wire.

Expect to replace the brush holder when tearing apart a well used Delco unit - brushes usually jam against wear ridges in the slip ring.

Earth wire when fitted (Bosch units in particular) is a separate wire connected to one of the bolts securing the alternator bracket to the engine.

Thinner dipstick with S-shape tube is the later type which goes with oil pan capacity reduced by about 0.5 litre, ostensibly to reduce leakage from the crankshaft rear seal.

Earlier dipstick and tube can be fitted but more often than not the tube will break unless it is driven out - i.e. remove oil pan first.
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  • What is real is not the external form but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși

Re: My New CF

Post by MattA24 » Subscribing Member » Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:25 pm
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:06 pm
Posts: 213
Hi Phil,

The spares van alternator is quite a new one, can't remember where I got it from now, possibly a cheap generic ebay seller.

When I got it I had to unbolt one end and twist the front casing round to turn it from a "right-handed" type to a "left-handed" type, then it fitted on the CF perfectly. I'll try and verify that the two terminals are connected internally, but getting a look will be tricky now as I've bolted it on :wall:

On the spares van (1974) there are two thick wires with two big crimps on the end, which were plugged into the two larger terminals on the alternator. I had them connected like that because the alternator before that was connected like that too. Does that mean those two wires are just duplicates of eachother?

Interesting about the oil capacity changing - is it just the advice that changed, or is the engine physically different? As I've been filling it 'blind' (ie: by volume) I've got in there as much as I would put in my older CFs? Is that now too much? :?:

I don't much like the newer s-shaped dipstick cos it's a bugger to get back down it's tube, but I wont try and change it, that sounds like a lot of work for marginal gain. However, I just don't get why I can't see the oil level on it! I'm beginning to wonder if it might be an entirely too short dipstick from some other motor which has been shoved in there for some reason over the years...

Re: My New CF

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Post by Phil Bradshaw » Club admin » Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:54 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm
Posts: 3791
Second thick brown wire is to up-rate the wiring to reduce cable heating at maximum alternator output; second wire should terminate with the first at the starter solenoid battery terminal.

Dipstick and tube shape are the only changes, introduced 1981. Good job I checked: capacity reduction by 0.5 pint, not 0.5 litre!

From August 1981 Service Bulletin -

ENGINE OIL DIPSTICK REVISIONS

Gasoline Engines

A revised dipstick recently has been introduced on Bedford CF models equipped with Bedford gasoline engines from Engine No.3396957.

The revised dipstick which reduces oil capacity by 0.28 litre (0.5 pint) is easier to remove and resist smearing on extraction.

The dipstick can be installed to earlier vehicles if required and is available from General Motors Parts Europe, Division of Vauxhall Motors Limited, under Part No. 91076290.


For 'smearing' read 'coming out full of emulsion (mayonnaise)'

Thinner dipstick is 690mm long overall; being difficult to read comes as standard.

Let the dipstick find its own way down the tube; don't worry if the top ends up looking cock-eyed compared to the earlier type, another standard feature...
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  • What is real is not the external form but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși

Re: My New CF

Post by MattA24 » Subscribing Member » Sat Sep 29, 2018 11:36 pm
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:06 pm
Posts: 213
Hmm, does that mean that this 78 van has picked up a later engine at some point then? Or possibly just a later dipstick tube, as those notes suggest was available.

My old-style dipstick certanly always came out mayonnaisey, but on the whole I think it was worth it because it also came out with a discernable bit of oil on the bottom :)

Re: My New CF

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Post by Phil Bradshaw » Club admin » Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:20 am
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm
Posts: 3791
Engine No. 3396957 is somewhere between 1978 (HY) and 1983 (DV) production years.

(Bulletins sometimes were a bit late compared to Parts Catalogue updates.)
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  • What is real is not the external form but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși

Re: My New CF

Post by MattA24 » Subscribing Member » Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:27 pm
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:06 pm
Posts: 213
Yesterday I took the CF for a drive around town! First time since the box on the back got demolished, and since I'd done all the fettling up thread. Some thoughts:
  • I had no idea how nippy a CF could be without all the crap on the back!
  • I had no idea how bouncy a CF could be without all the crap on the back!
  • My propshaft seemed happy with the new centre bearing mounting!
  • The swapped in oil pressure sensor fixed the oil light fault!
I also took a scrobble underneath to wire up the overdrive and see if it worked. I deleted the confusing rats' nest of dead-end wires hanging around the gearbox and put in a new one of my own. And.... Nothing.

Further exploration turned up that the natty little "E" switch on the gearstick is defunct. I'm going to try and fix that because I'm rather attached to it. Also, the sensor on the driver's side of the gearbox also appears to be broken, as it seems to allow current to pass no matter what gear I'm in.

So temporarily ignoring the sensor, and wiring in a temporary switch I took the van for another spin and... Overdrive! :D :D :D

So I guess I'm going to need to replace the little sensor on the side of the gearbox. Or are they repairable? Or am I just going to have to be very careful about what gear I'm in :?:

Cheerio! :brew:

Re: My New CF

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Post by Phil Bradshaw » Club admin » Wed Oct 03, 2018 11:28 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm
Posts: 3791
'Sensor' for overdrive is a spring-loaded switch; if there is a lock nut and enough thread on the switch shank then try adjusting the position for the switch to be off (contacts open) in 1st and 2nd gears; reverse also will be off in this position.

Meanwhile a 12V warning lamp wired to the solenoid side of whichever of the switches is easier to get at and earthed to the dash should do as a reminder for when the overdrive is engaged.
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  • What is real is not the external form but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși

Re: My New CF

Post by MattA24 » Subscribing Member » Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:43 pm
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:06 pm
Posts: 213
Phil - good idea on the dash warning lamp for overdrive.

I adjusted the switch everywither but no luck, so I pulled it out for a closer look. It was clear that someone had dismantled itin the past because the brass lip that gets folded over the plastic bit had obvious signs of previous mangling. I dismantled it and could get it to work intermittently but not reliably, so I'm going to assume it's had it's day. For now I'm going to leave it disconnected, and if I can't source a replacement, I might ditch the plastic bit and attempt to glue a microswitch into the end of the metal part to do the job instead.

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