Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Very kind!
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
(ANOTHER) silly question - I've got 3 seemingly identical o-rings in my gasket kit. I'm guessing one replaces the o-ring on the oil pickup, and the other two on the bottom of the oil pump?
Edit: one more silly question while I'm sat here asking them - an associate down here at the workshop has advocated sticking the sump gasket down with a smear of RTV, rather than the carpet spray recommended elsewhere on this forum. Any thoughts? Also, by carpet spray, are we referring to this sort of thing?
Edit: one more silly question while I'm sat here asking them - an associate down here at the workshop has advocated sticking the sump gasket down with a smear of RTV, rather than the carpet spray recommended elsewhere on this forum. Any thoughts? Also, by carpet spray, are we referring to this sort of thing?
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Post
by Phil Bradshaw
» Club admin » Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:47 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm Posts: 4755
You've answered your own question on O-rings. 
Sticking cork gaskets down keeps them in place during assembly: the gasket does the sealing so the adhesive doesn't have to be permanent. A smear if grease will do if the gaskets align well.
Carpet glue = contact adhesive in a spray can.
Black silicone RTV can be used on the gasket and end seals junctions when fitting the sump.
.
Sticking cork gaskets down keeps them in place during assembly: the gasket does the sealing so the adhesive doesn't have to be permanent. A smear if grease will do if the gaskets align well.
Carpet glue = contact adhesive in a spray can.
Black silicone RTV can be used on the gasket and end seals junctions when fitting the sump.
.
- What is real is not the appearance but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Quick Q - I'm just knocking the old core plugs out of the head. I've done the bigger one at each end, and now it's time for the various tiddlers. It appears that there's 4 on the exhaust side, and two on the inlet side close together. Is that right?
It also appears that my ebay set doesn't match what I'm seeing. I've got 6 small plugs, but in 3 different sizes (two of each)...
Thoughts appreciated!
Matt
It also appears that my ebay set doesn't match what I'm seeing. I've got 6 small plugs, but in 3 different sizes (two of each)...
Thoughts appreciated!
Matt
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Post
by Phil Bradshaw
» Club admin » Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:47 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm Posts: 4755
Earlier cylinder head has 8 core plugs.
Nominal diameters -
Front and rear (2): 1.1/2 inch
Intake side (2): 3/4 inch
Exhaust side (4): 5/8 inch
.
Nominal diameters -
Front and rear (2): 1.1/2 inch
Intake side (2): 3/4 inch
Exhaust side (4): 5/8 inch
.
- What is real is not the appearance but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
This engine is out of a 1974 van, does that count as early?
My set appears to have:
- 2 x 5/8
- 2 x 11/16
- 2 x 3/4
I guess I need to find two more 5/8" plugs then...
My set appears to have:
- 2 x 5/8
- 2 x 11/16
- 2 x 3/4
I guess I need to find two more 5/8" plugs then...
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Post
by Phil Bradshaw
» Club admin » Fri Dec 13, 2019 8:51 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm Posts: 4755
Later head with exhaust valve rotator caps introduced from Ch. Ch.FY600001- (start of 1976 production year) doesn't have the 4 core plugs on the exhaust side.
.
.
- What is real is not the appearance but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Hello!
New Year's Resolution - hurry up with this engine and get the van back on the road.
As I'm going to get a mate in town specially to help with the grunt work of lifting in and out engines, I'm trying to plan ahead for the whole operation, and some questions arise -
1) Phil! - In A cooked engine (that thread basically being my main reference material for this work), you mention that the gaskets direct head gasket recommends using goo of some kind. Did you do that when you built that engine up? If so, what goo? How much? Which side? etc!
2) Phil! Also in that thread, one detail missing is whether you used anything sticky along with the gaskets when putting the manifolds back on?
3) The van that is getting this engine has a Vauxhall 4 speed gearbox with laycock, and when I drop the gearbox to swap engines, I'm hoping to use it as a chance to try and make the gearbox a bit more oil-tight. Other than the lid on the bottom of the gearbox and the lid on the bottom of the overdrive, are there any other common leaks worth investigating? (It's hard to spot where the oil is leaving the gearbox, because the entire thing is soaking with oil spewing from the engine!)
More questions to follow, I fear!
Cheers as always,
Matt
New Year's Resolution - hurry up with this engine and get the van back on the road.
As I'm going to get a mate in town specially to help with the grunt work of lifting in and out engines, I'm trying to plan ahead for the whole operation, and some questions arise -
1) Phil! - In A cooked engine (that thread basically being my main reference material for this work), you mention that the gaskets direct head gasket recommends using goo of some kind. Did you do that when you built that engine up? If so, what goo? How much? Which side? etc!
2) Phil! Also in that thread, one detail missing is whether you used anything sticky along with the gaskets when putting the manifolds back on?
3) The van that is getting this engine has a Vauxhall 4 speed gearbox with laycock, and when I drop the gearbox to swap engines, I'm hoping to use it as a chance to try and make the gearbox a bit more oil-tight. Other than the lid on the bottom of the gearbox and the lid on the bottom of the overdrive, are there any other common leaks worth investigating? (It's hard to spot where the oil is leaving the gearbox, because the entire thing is soaking with oil spewing from the engine!)
More questions to follow, I fear!
Cheers as always,
Matt
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Post
by Phil Bradshaw
» Club admin » Fri Jan 03, 2020 5:55 pm
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:15 pm Posts: 4755
1 and 2. The Gaskets Direct (now J&M Gaskets & Seals) cylinder head gasket comes with additional sealant around its periphery.
Otherwise no glue is needed on any gasket unless the metal faces aren't too clever (intake manifold for one) or if a gasket is likely to slip out of alignment, when Hylomar Blue or similar non-setting gasket adhesive usually will do.
Cam cover gasket: see this topic. Generic spray can contact adhesive that smells like Evo-Stik will substitute for carpet glue: it degrades in oil (which is handy for disassembly and getting a second use from a gasket) but it only has to stick during initial assembly.
Distributor to oil pump: use Hylomar Blue less gasket (GM recommendation). This allows time to adjust dynamic ignition timing before the glue loses its mobility.
In general: prior to assembly cleaned gasket faces should be wiped down with acetone or similar volatile solvent that leaves no residue.
3. Gearbox can leak from front and rear gaskets and also the front bearing oil seal but first almost completely dismantle the gearbox.
Overdrive must be engaged in third or fourth speed gear then disengaged with clutch pedal depressed before removing the transmission or it will be impossible to separate the overdrive unit from the gearbox due to residual torsional load within the unit.
Gearbox front and rear gasket thickness of 0.2mm is essential for maintaining correct location of the mainshaft assembly in relation to the main drive pinion. Thicker gaskets can affect 4th speed synchromesh operation and using just glue without gaskets also is dodgy: can restrict oil flow through the mainshaft spigot rollers if the rollers thrust ring axial clearance closes up too much.
Check the 1/2-inch diameter cup plugs in the bottom cover: any corroded thin should be replaced before they leak, when ALL the oil content can disappear rather quickly.
Adaptor to overdrive joint usually doesn't leak unless clan Bodger has been at it. I think the gasket is 0.4mm thick but I could be wrong - it's a long time since I've seen a new gasket.
Overdrive without 4-bolt flange: worn propellor shaft sleeve yoke and, or, rear bush and seal can leak for fun. Fix is not cheap: overdrive casing has to have a bush fitted and reamed for a re-machined sleeve yoke (as in finding a new one is almost impossible) and the seal inner diameter has to be sized accordingly.
Overdrive with 4-bolt flange for CF models: seal can leak when hardened with age. When sizing a seal for a replacement watch for Imperial (inch) dimensions for earlier units. If the seal has no dimensions on its outer face then measure the seal outer diameter, seal land diameter on the flange (= seal inner diameter) and seal thickness before going shopping.
.
Otherwise no glue is needed on any gasket unless the metal faces aren't too clever (intake manifold for one) or if a gasket is likely to slip out of alignment, when Hylomar Blue or similar non-setting gasket adhesive usually will do.
Cam cover gasket: see this topic. Generic spray can contact adhesive that smells like Evo-Stik will substitute for carpet glue: it degrades in oil (which is handy for disassembly and getting a second use from a gasket) but it only has to stick during initial assembly.
Distributor to oil pump: use Hylomar Blue less gasket (GM recommendation). This allows time to adjust dynamic ignition timing before the glue loses its mobility.
In general: prior to assembly cleaned gasket faces should be wiped down with acetone or similar volatile solvent that leaves no residue.
3. Gearbox can leak from front and rear gaskets and also the front bearing oil seal but first almost completely dismantle the gearbox.
Overdrive must be engaged in third or fourth speed gear then disengaged with clutch pedal depressed before removing the transmission or it will be impossible to separate the overdrive unit from the gearbox due to residual torsional load within the unit.
Gearbox front and rear gasket thickness of 0.2mm is essential for maintaining correct location of the mainshaft assembly in relation to the main drive pinion. Thicker gaskets can affect 4th speed synchromesh operation and using just glue without gaskets also is dodgy: can restrict oil flow through the mainshaft spigot rollers if the rollers thrust ring axial clearance closes up too much.
Check the 1/2-inch diameter cup plugs in the bottom cover: any corroded thin should be replaced before they leak, when ALL the oil content can disappear rather quickly.
Adaptor to overdrive joint usually doesn't leak unless clan Bodger has been at it. I think the gasket is 0.4mm thick but I could be wrong - it's a long time since I've seen a new gasket.
Overdrive without 4-bolt flange: worn propellor shaft sleeve yoke and, or, rear bush and seal can leak for fun. Fix is not cheap: overdrive casing has to have a bush fitted and reamed for a re-machined sleeve yoke (as in finding a new one is almost impossible) and the seal inner diameter has to be sized accordingly.
Overdrive with 4-bolt flange for CF models: seal can leak when hardened with age. When sizing a seal for a replacement watch for Imperial (inch) dimensions for earlier units. If the seal has no dimensions on its outer face then measure the seal outer diameter, seal land diameter on the flange (= seal inner diameter) and seal thickness before going shopping.
.
- What is real is not the appearance but the idea, the essence of things. Constantin Brâncuși
Re: Rear Crank Seal / Engine Out
Hi Phil - Thanks again for the clarifications!
Regards the gearbox, this van has the sleeve yoke type, which I presume means it's come out of a car of some sort?
My old mate Smiley Pete is coming down this weekend, so we're going to give this swap-over a crack. Wish me luck, and brace for lots of incoming questions!
I'm going to spend today putting the valves back in the head. Am I right in thinking that I can do a first set-up of the tappet adjuster screws by attaching the cam carrier to the head while it's off the engine? If I recall, I should adjust the expected tappet clearances to account for coldness, and to account for not sticking a gasket between the two?
Many many thanks, as ever!
Matt
Regards the gearbox, this van has the sleeve yoke type, which I presume means it's come out of a car of some sort?
My old mate Smiley Pete is coming down this weekend, so we're going to give this swap-over a crack. Wish me luck, and brace for lots of incoming questions!
I'm going to spend today putting the valves back in the head. Am I right in thinking that I can do a first set-up of the tappet adjuster screws by attaching the cam carrier to the head while it's off the engine? If I recall, I should adjust the expected tappet clearances to account for coldness, and to account for not sticking a gasket between the two?
Many many thanks, as ever!
Matt